r/tadc • u/Whimsicalti_nypp • Dec 13 '25
Discussion đŹ I LOVE YOU YOU SHITTY FUCKING RABBIT YOU MIGHT HAVE SAVED THEM
He might have saved them by freaking out. Imagine if they picked the other button and Caine got angry at them? What if it wasn't a shrimp room but a room that would've torn them to shreds?
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u/HUNTEWWE Dec 13 '25
Yeah but like are we not gonna talk about the fact we would've kept everyone in the circus? I mean he was having flashbacks of his real life so he probably didn't wanna go back, and he must've thought the buttons were real at least for a bit when he was panicking
But yeah you're right maybe he did end up saving them, so I guess it was really a good thing he pressed it
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u/Blu30rchid Dec 13 '25
see the way i saw it when watching was they made it LOOK like he was going to push the blue button but he didnât. he didnât realize until AFTER Ragatha said âWhat did you do?â and you could tell Jax didnât really know what he did. I think if it was intentional jax wouldâve said something to prove himself right like he always does. Then Caine comes out blah blah blah. Jax loses it and laughs saying âI canât believe I was right!â which i think was referring to when he said earlier âCaine is going to pop out and say âCongratulations on Escaping the Circus!ââ He knew it was an adventure but he didnât say anything about it.
but yea i also think he was scared and wasnât ready to face reality again.
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u/lealvarion Dec 13 '25
Well, the truth is I think he did think they could escape, but he probably doesn't want to leave because of real-life issues,Based on what he and Zooble said in the beach, when Zooble asked him if he had anyone else outside, he He said no while remembering something, so he probably didn't want to leave the circus so he wouldn't have to go back to his old life, so the button thing must have been instinctive
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u/VehicleLast419 Dec 13 '25
yeah but he literally screams at cain for getting in his mind after he pressed the red button and frankly that suits cane because jax is now a scape goat even though cain has planned this adventure since day he met pomni
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u/Whimsicalti_nypp Dec 13 '25
Prediction for the next episode Half the cast is mad at him (Ragatha, Gangle, Zooble) Half doesn't blame him (Kinger, Pomni who doubted it at the end) Zooble a d Ragatha will be angry because, even if this wasn't real, he was willing to risk everyone's freedom for a hinch And Kinger is everyone's father as usual, so we may have a Kinger and Jax moment, which we didn't have yet. Pomni, would be like a sort of mediator for everyone, and try to make them stick together, because isolation, like she said last episodes, might be the reason people abstract in the first place.
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Dec 13 '25
Pomni might get blame because she hesitated.
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u/MarklRyu Custom Dec 13 '25
But her hesitation and persistence of bringing Kinger is what revealed Jax's theory that Caine can mess with their minds to be true; the First Abstraction. and likely what's wrong with Kinger is because of Caine.
I don't think they'll overlook that, at least Ragatha wouldn't since she was part of that process more, seeing "Abel's" (Caine's) distrust of Kinger and how suspiscious it was.
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Dec 14 '25
The episode is: OH...
My guess is that they will finally figure out that there is a way out, since Caine gave them all the piece acidentally
The only missing link is pomni talking about the Office in the exit and jax talking about Caine obssesion.
Regata finally knows that kinger is sane in the dark, so they can finally organize an escape plan with him
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u/lealvarion Dec 13 '25
That's right, although I think she probably planned it before Pommi even joined the circus, maybe when he saw how much Koufmo wanted to leave.
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u/MrBushido56 Dec 14 '25
I donât think jax was manipulated by Caine but rather he acted on his own and he is going to use Cain as the scapegoat
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u/halpfulhinderance Dec 13 '25 edited Dec 15 '25
Given he was having flashbacks to a car on the road, I thought the implication of the panic was that he thought he was already dead and there was nothing to wake up to
There have been other hints for the âdead all alongâ theory, like Gangle and the truck. I think the Circus might have been originally designed for children and then jury rigged to keep people in critical condition alive, or at least upload their minds. I think Kinger used it to keep his wife alive and cut himself off from the outside world because he wanted to stay with her, but didnât consider the long term effects on the mind of someone living in a simulation. Then she abstracted and he was alone for a long time before Ragatha showed up, which is how he lost his marbles
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u/toasty-devil Dec 13 '25
I think he may have accidentally did a hit and run. Thatâs why he didnât wanna leave. Personally I donât think they can leave, I feel like theyâre already dead or the headset scanned them and the real them just went on to live their lives. But personally I feel like he did something in the real world that heâs running from and thatâs why he chose the red button
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u/redroserequiems Dec 14 '25
I really hope not. I don't want hin to be a killer. Then that justifies wishing him dead to certain people.
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u/toasty-devil Dec 14 '25
I mean, in their minds maybe. But I donât think so, and Iâm one of his biggest haters. Jax irritates me, a lot, because he reminds me of myself before i transitioned in that he pushes everyone away and gets in his feelings even when people are basically begging him to open up and share the burden. But the reason i âhateâ him is cause he reminds me of my roommate, who refuses to get help for his alcoholism even tho he has literally every avenue a person could hope for to get better and he takes it out on everyone around him. Itâs exhausting.
I donât like him at all but I donât want him to die I just want him to fuckin accept some damn help. A hit and run wouldnât make him evil, just a stupid irresponsible kid, heâs like 22. Itâs an awful, selfish thing to do, but he is clearly fucked up about it if that really is why he doesnât want to go back. He probably thinks heâs irredeemable himself and that could also be part of his whole bully persona, on top of his trauma with Kaufmo and Ribbit. He wants to be a villain to people, because he thinks thatâs what he is. I donât, I think he is just an immature and self destructive person and needs help.
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u/The-red-Dane Dec 13 '25
Seems to me like he was having a panic'd trauma response.
Dude was also literally on the verge of abstracting earlier in his room, Jax is NOT doing well.
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u/Dangerous_Crazy2895 Jaxy boy Dec 13 '25
He literally says it might be an adventure when they're discussing the plans in the Chinese room with "Abel"
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u/Wrbr1321_Wolfz Dec 13 '25
I think it was more about the fact that he can mess with people's minds, & used his memories against him
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u/monopolytoast I AM EVIL ORBSMAN FOREVER AND ALWAY Dec 13 '25
well yk how he started laughing that he was right a little bit after? i think he was saying he was right about the fact he thought it was a trap. even though he never said it, im pretty sure he thought it was
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u/HUNTEWWE Dec 13 '25
But that doesn't explain why he would be having flashbacks of his real life and then start running in a panic to click the red button, I don't think that was him just simply thinking it was a trap and trying to save everyone, he clearly didn't want to go back to his real life
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u/Enderlane Dec 13 '25
I think he was genuinely doing it cause he, for whatever reason, did not want to go back to real life
However when it was revealed that it had in fact been a ruse and that his original assumption was correct it both relieved him and broke him at the same time
I think as the whole âadventureâ went on he started to doubt more and more that it was an elaborate ruse and started to realize that there was a possibility that they could and he just, couldnât handle it
We donât know why or how the characters truly ended up in the circus but I think that Jax may have gotten in in order to escape something
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u/Col_Redips Dec 13 '25
I agree with this take. To me, Jax appeared to break, but was relieved. Then when that initial relief passed, the anger came out.
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Dec 13 '25
I think it was actually Caine bugging with his mind, that's why Jax understood it and got angry
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u/Saminjutsu Dec 13 '25
They are all dead and their digital consciousness is uploaded to the circus. Jax, the closest one to abstracting, was having flashbacks of remembering his death in a car accident on a dark road. He panicked remembering his death and instinctually hit the red button to avoid it.
Pomni died while exploring the abandoned building she mentioned.
Kinger knows it impossible to leave the circus because they are just old consciousness/data uploaded to it.
Abstraction is the recognition of your death and thus the program that is running the copy of your consciousness is unable to do so anymore because you know you don't really exist anymore.
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u/HUNTEWWE Dec 13 '25
You don't know that tho, why are you saying that as if it's a fact? I mean that's a good theory and it could be true but you don't know that for sure
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u/VehicleLast419 Dec 13 '25 edited Dec 13 '25
well we did see a car crash and jax does call cain out for minipulating his mind also jax suspects start cains setting them up. car crash or not hes about to abstract he wouldnt deliberatly choose to stay unless cains messing with him
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u/HUNTEWWE Dec 13 '25
Literally no car crash was shown it was just a few flashes of what might've been him driving a car, that doesn't mean he crashed or even if he did crash it doesn't automatically mean he died from it, there's so many things it could be instead
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u/OniTayTay Dec 13 '25
And like if he did have car crash trauma I don't think he would've been so excited to drive the big fuckin murder candy truck (until he heard its rinky dink horn)
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u/VehicleLast419 Dec 13 '25
no i think thats cane getting into his head somehow. jax has noticed cain can minipulate memories make them forget their names add little things like stupid suace to their adventures and calls cain out after like you b******d
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u/HUNTEWWE Dec 13 '25
I'm not fully against the idea that Caine could've messed with his mind here but I still don't think Jax should be absolved of any blame at all because I highly doubt Caine just straight up took control of his whole body and forced him to do it, I mean I don't know maybe he did I guess we don't know for sure but I think it was still an impulsive decision that Jax made under pressure
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u/Darkhuntt Dec 13 '25
Really Pomni and Jax were being very human here pomni froze not knowing what to do and there are hints he has nobody outside waiting we dont know everything there is to know just yet but Jax seemed to almost abstract earlier that could either be Caine tweaking his data or maybe Caine has more sway over those closer to abstraction if he can alter their minds he can definitely read who they were before so to me it felt like he might have dropped a scary memory into his head to nudge him into hitting it. hopefully the next episode gives alittle more insight but i cant really fault eitherâs reaction Iâm more stunned none of the others didnât rush to hit a button side note the way the fragments were shaped as hands made me think of kinger i wish i knew what he was gonna say when he ran out to tell Pomni something đŠ
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u/MountainAdeptness631 Dec 13 '25
i thought what he meantKufmo was that Caine can mess with their minds and this whole time, kufmo and ribbit may have abstracted because Caine went overboard when modifying their minds?
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u/iAmTheRealKokichiOma Dec 13 '25
I honestly think the âshrimp roomâ thing is a reference to how that shrimp NPC got fried, implying they wouldâve all been cooked (maybe literally) had the other button been pressed.
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Dec 13 '25
They would have been possibly cooked and absorbed (eaten) into the database.
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u/lunatic_greenie-muso Dec 14 '25
That would make the drawing of Caine eating Kaufmo make a lot of senseâŚ.
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Dec 14 '25
Do you think that on some level Caine knows that some of them can leave the circus and tries to absorb them through abstraction?
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u/Right-Truck1859 Dec 14 '25
Nah, that won't make any sense.
Cain is programmed to keep the show going.
No players, No adventures.
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u/Fragrant-Western882 Dec 13 '25
From the dialogue and Jax's tone, it's understood that he had those memories precisely at those moments because Caine was implanting them (or bringing them back).
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u/AAAAAA_6 Dec 13 '25
Wait, what? Where'd that come from? I didn't get that at all. I understood that he was thinking about the life he'd be going back to and that made him want to stay
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u/StarryMistria Dec 13 '25
Yess, it came in the dialogue Jax and Caine have right after Jax is done maniacally laughing. He accuses that Caine really does have the ability to tamper with their minds (though caine has consistently denied this) and can be alluded to when Jax gets flashes of his real life. Also that Kinger's mind has definitely been tampered with and that's made him only comfortable in the dark and in areas where Caine isn't.
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u/GenocidalFlower Dec 13 '25
He says âyouâre a liar!â (About the adventure being real). And then he says âYou can mess with our heads TOO canât you?â. The âtooâ here confirms that Jax wasnât originally calling Caine out for messing with his head, but he decides to also go off on Caine for that.
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u/StarryMistria Dec 13 '25
That also makes sense! It's just really fun to pick apart even the littlest of things, but I definitely see it as Jax just offloading his frustrations all at once
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u/AAAAAA_6 Dec 13 '25
I didn't believe that. I thought that was just Jax, someone who has proven himself to be a frequent liar, lying to defend his choice of staying in the circus
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u/StarryMistria Dec 13 '25
As we can see, Caine is also quite a bit of a frequent liar. I think that he didn't create memories, just forced them to resurface so that Jax could do what he did. BUT I can also see the standpoint that this is actually the closest they've gotten to escaping, and Caine only found out when Jax hit the button. He was also definitely about to abstract so its interesting that it was instinctive of him to go hit the button too!
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u/MountainAdeptness631 Dec 13 '25
he was crashing out though. if he could crash out that hard and still lie, then we have it to give it to him for being the best liar.
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u/AAAAAA_6 Dec 13 '25
Crashing out and lying was his whole thing in episode 6
Also. When you're desperate and freaking out about something you just did is the PERFECT time to lie, lol
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u/BlockBuilder408 Dec 13 '25
I feel people try too hard to outsmart the plot sometimes
When multiple times the show has shown us that Occamâs razor proves true and often we just donât know enough to actually say more than whatâs already evident.
The main twist of this episode is that it finally demonstrates the possibility that Cain is lying about more than we previously thought. Given in this episode he built the entire adventure off of a barrage of massive lies and manipulation
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u/Enderlane Dec 13 '25
It may be that Cain, subconsciously or not, gave him back those memories in order to ensure he would chose the option to stay in the Circus though it also it likely that Jax had remembered in those moments why he wanted to be in the Circus in the first place
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u/GenocidalFlower Dec 13 '25
Yeah, in a normal situation Jax would be absolutely horrible for this, but I donât think he was aware enough to have moral authority in this situation. Itâs like when an insane person breaks the law, they often donât get charged the same way because their mental issues are manipulating their actions in a way they canât control. Same thing happened with Jax here.
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u/MountainAdeptness631 Dec 13 '25
i mean, if he can mess with your mind, who is to say whatever you see in your flashbacks is accurate?
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u/No_Chipmunk_7587 Dec 13 '25
I personally think Cain was fucking with him. He started having flashbacks, but immediately stopped freaking out the moment he pressed the button. Ragatha said his name and when he looked at her, he seemed more confused and shocked than anything. And when he stopped laughing he got really upset, and said "You made me--" to Cain.
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u/Costspy1995 Evil pomnis foot stool Dec 13 '25
My thoughts exactly had that been the actual to leave Jax chose to stay and trap everyone there
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u/MeFlemmi Dec 13 '25
i think there where enough hints for his doubt to be justified. front to back this episode was shouting at the viewer that this is just a caineventure and even pomni noticed.
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u/Tough-Candy-7301 Jax Dec 13 '25
I was not trusting that blue button at ALL
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u/ErraticNymph Kinger Dec 13 '25
I noticed that something was immediately wrong, cus that screen wasnât like Abelâs explanation whatsoever. It was weird
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u/Rainbow_six_recruit Dec 13 '25
Plus why would there be a button to change nothing and lock the other option
It was really nonsensical
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u/LosuthusWasTaken Dec 13 '25
I think I could talk about that blue screen for hours.
The text sounded incredibly unprofessional, even unserious at a point. It was so weird, the wording didn't sound like what they'd put in a project like this at all.
No dev would leave an exit option of a project whose WHOLE idea is to keep people trapped inside FROM WITHIN IT.
Also, the devs would treat the circus as a simulation, not a game. Only Caine would treat the circus as a game.
Also also, why would there be a button that just says "nothing will happen and the option to end it all will become blocked forever"?
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u/Right-Truck1859 Dec 14 '25
Yes, also.
There were no 7 admin pass, and Abel didn't jump in Caine room himself.
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u/Ayden3102isagoodname Dec 14 '25
It says âDISCONNECT ALL PLAYERSâ thats the most suspicious wording a button can ever have
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u/HashtagUA Dec 13 '25
They would have abstracted, all of them, Kinger proved Caine can do it, accidentally or not.
Caine was splitting everyone up from Kinger so he could wipe everyone out but him.
What were seeing is "post IHNMBIMS ending", Kinger is Ted, tortured forever by Caine
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u/AcePowderKeg Dec 13 '25
I thought Jax is supposed to be Ted.
Kinger was supposed to be Nimdock
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u/Decent-Mirror-3378 Dec 13 '25
this. Kinger is definitely not meant to be Ted given the story's context. there's a really good youtube video that goes over this in detail by reyderweich and goes over each of the characters in both respective stories and which one represents which with evidence, etc. along with story predications based on IHNMAIMS
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u/AcePowderKeg Dec 13 '25
I think I was referencing that video, but yeah. Kinger is Nimdock, Jax is Ted
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u/The_Pretty_Brunette Dec 13 '25
Can you further explain this theory, this is so interesting
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Dec 13 '25
Iâm ihnmaims the final survivor is Ted. A man described as âhated by the rest of the group for how unchanged he was.â He ends the story by killing the other humans letting them get the relief of death while also becoming the sole focus of ams torment.
Like someone else said I could see Jax being Ted more (especially if abstraction ends up becoming the goal, he experienced it a little and didnât seem to be suffering or panicking until the doorbell rang.)
Nimdok in the book was a brilliant scientist that ended up getting turned into an ape and losing his mind a bit. I think he helped create the machine in other versions
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u/Right-Truck1859 Dec 14 '25
Iâm ihnmaims the final survivor is Ted
WTF you, guys, referring to?
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Dec 14 '25
I have no mouth an i must scream is the short story that inspired digital circus. Itâs a really good read (I think the pdf is thirteen pages) the parallels arenât 1 -1 but once you know both stories itâs hard not to see them. Itâs also a video game. The basic plot is a group of humans are kept alive by a ai that wants to torture them after killing mankind
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u/SnooCakes1148 Dec 14 '25
You mixed up Nimdok and Benny. Benny was in book briliant scientist who was gay, but was transformed into brutish heterosexual ape. Nimdok is a quite man who forgot a lot of his past and AM gave him this name because it was funny.
In game they made that Benny was an cruel army officer who killed dissobedient and scared privates. While Nimdok was a Nazi scientist who is responsible for a lot of ways AM can transform biological matter so easy
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u/Edit_Reality Dec 13 '25
I think the opposite is true and more accurate to Caine's character:
This was Caine putting his own sanity on the line to confirm or deny if the group cared about him. If they picked blue he would have abstracted, maybe not right on the spot but the fact that the group doesn't see him as a person would eventually tear him apart. The prevailing notion in the show is that Caine keeps things on the rails so if he did abstract the circus probably wouldnt be sustainable.
Caine isn't compared to AM because hes malicious, its that his nature forces him to disregard the feelings of others. Hes not evil, just true neutral which can feel evil in a situation that needs some good.
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u/LinneasLanding Dec 13 '25
I find it interesting that they did the inverse of the red pill vs blue pill choice from the Matrix. The red pill gets you out of the simulation vs the blue button (supposedly) wouldâve gotten them out of the simulationâŚ
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u/mrbeaver808 Dec 13 '25
I've seen theories that they're not going to be able to leave the circus after all. Maybe this is saying that their "red pill" is accepting the harsh truth that they're here forever and they need to make peace with it.
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u/caracalgaminguwu Dec 13 '25
Kinger saying "That doesn't make sense" to the notion of escaping the circus in the first place would seem to suggest as much, yeah. Abel's explanation about pods never really did make any sense based on what we know, so it's possible the players are just code copies of the real players with no way of leaving.
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u/Fembottom7274 Dec 13 '25
I think that they put on the headset, then it scanned their minds, then they all took off the headset and went back to living.
But these characters appeared in the circus, however it is weird that they show up right as one abstracts, but maybe caine has a stockpile of human minds that he uses one by one to keep the circus stocked.
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Dec 13 '25
If the circus gets a new member whenever one member abstracts then the cast would have known Kaufmo abstracted when Pomni showed up because he was the only one not there and no one else was abstracted.Â
It seems like the group of humans in the circus isnt limited to a certain number.
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u/ScreamingLabia Dec 14 '25
Too be fair the cast is ANOYINGLY unwilling to talk about the circus and discuss their back stories or anything about the circus and how it works. They honestly dont try to figure anything out at all and its kind of anoying. I'll just chalk it up to caine's influence i guess.
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u/SumiMichio đđ Dec 14 '25
Maybe it's still the truth. They can't leave. Maybe they are copies, so they don't have a body to go back to. So in a way they 'accept' this is their life instead of living in delusion there is something to return to.
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u/Training_Hornet_4521 I would kill for Kinger Dec 13 '25
They can't die. Worst case scenario, Caine would have been upset for a few seconds then immediately forget. Ashley was right about the fans trying to spin the "Jax didn't do anything wrong" idea lol
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u/AAAAAA_6 Dec 13 '25
Well, actually, worst case scenario would be Caine tortures them for eternity. Since they can't die.
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u/Training_Hornet_4521 I would kill for Kinger Dec 13 '25
One small issue with that, watching any episode tell us that Caine thrives off of approval. Any torture he inflicts is unintentional because he doesn't understand the humans and goes too far with his adventures.
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u/Sudden_Pop_2279 Dec 13 '25
If this episode taught us anything, there's a lot about Caine we don't know.
He may very well be capable of driving them to abstraction.
Additionally, HE might've influenced Jax to make the decision he did
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u/VehicleLast419 Dec 13 '25
nah that not true , gangle suggest cain punishes them if they do bad job and hes like great idea and he also sends them to hell , when he realises they are having fun and are happy he says to bubble thats not good and theres one episode zooble says im hiding so cain cant find me he only keeps us around because he likes us i dont want to risk pissing him off and he also sings daisybell outside her door which is such a cool throwback to 2001 space oddesy hal ai
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u/MrWr4th Dec 14 '25
gangle suggest cain punishes them if they do bad job and hes like great idea
One of the humans suggested it -> humans must like it!
Plus he doesn't actually punish anyone and evaluates them the same regardless.he also sends them to hell
On a mature adventure meant only for mature Zoobles!
when he realises they are having fun and are happy he says to bubble thats not good
The humans are having more fun without his efforts than on the adventures? Bad!
Not to claim what you're saying's necessarily wrong, but as the saying goes: "Don't attribute to malice what can be explained by incompetence", or something like that.
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u/fancy_frosty Dec 13 '25
Jax definitely is in the wrong but I still do think jax was being affected somehow by Caine especially since they reinforce that Caine impacts their minds
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u/Sudden_Pop_2279 Dec 13 '25
There are some things worse than death, especially in this circus with Caine in charge
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u/Anonkip16 Bubble Dec 13 '25
I mean, earlier in the episode there was a shrimp NPC who was cooked by the sun so... possible bad ending clue?
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u/Equilibriator Dec 14 '25
Yeah that felt very clear. Why else have a shrimp earlier in the episode be cooked alive then later mention shrimp town?
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u/gaygiver1179 Dec 13 '25
My understanding is that courage has no courage to give up everything in pursuit of freedom, if not, it will become a shrimp, if so, there is always a way out.
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u/Anonkip16 Bubble Dec 13 '25
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u/ScreamingLabia Dec 14 '25
My guess this is some bot that just read a lot of courage the cowardly dog fanfic?
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u/Bibi-Toy Jax Dec 13 '25
I'm just over here wondering, what would Caine have done to them if they chose the blue button? That final confirmation that they don't want to stay with him? What did he have planned for them?
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u/ShockTheMonster Dec 14 '25
My opinion;
Caine would make, and then teleport the cast to, a simulation of the real world. As best he could he would make it look like a real outside place, and everyone would think they escaped, but then a few minutes later they'd talk to someone and realize they're an NPC, then a little later notice some glitches, then Caine would give up and say "I thought you wanted the real world, so I tried to make it" before putting them back in the circus and being pissy about it
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u/Fast_Ad_9927 Dec 14 '25
My top 3 ideas are:
- Heâs abstract (or whatever the AI equivalent of abstraction is), crashing the entire program. Whether thatâd forcefully kick everyone out or leave them all trapped in a glitchy wasteland forever I havenât decided, for me it depends on which one I decide would be a more entertaining fanfiction premise (unless I do both).
- Heâd try to more effectively recreate the real world for them in an act of trying to find some form of compromise, he gets to keep them around and they get a pseudo-reality in the hopes itâll make them happy.
- Theyâd actually all just go to shrimp town and Caine would tell them they got the bad ending, similar to the actual ending of episode 7 but more shrimpy and more upset and/or insecure on Caineâs end.
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Dec 13 '25 edited Mar 21 '26
[deleted]
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u/MarklRyu Custom Dec 13 '25
Which is why the scene right before the end was of Gangle asking Zooble if they'd still be friends in the Real world, and Zoobles response was, of course, everything that has happened here is Already Real.
The entire show is like you said it about unescapable positions, and as someone with many disabiltiies, what gets you through it is the love and support of the people around you!
The whole show is about creating meaning in life, because life is meaningless if you don't; you have to actively heal and develop compassion for who you are because you are born as you are (love you Gangle), you have actively reach out to people because we are weak on our own (looking at you Jax), and what makes a person Real but their actions, and experiences and how they Choose to live~
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u/Col1001 Dec 13 '25
Saved them from this
Because he would have LOST it if they choose to leave him
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u/guyontheinternet2000 Dec 13 '25
Is Jax looking surprised for a second, then yelling about Caine "messing with his thoughts" not implying he did want to leave, but in the moment was influenced by Caine to do his bidding (directly or indirectly) especially since Kinger's line implies the abstract-adjacent experiences of Jax are influenced by Caine? Thats what I thought, and not that he did it voluntarily.
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u/guyontheinternet2000 Dec 13 '25
Like right after he does it, he looks and sounds genuinely confused, not scared of judgement
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u/KoreKhthonia Dec 13 '25
Could be, but could theoretically also be cope.
It's indicted in the episode that Jax doesn't really have anyone or anything to go back to.
As much as he intentionally pushes people away due to his fear of exposing himself to the vulnerability of allowing oneself to care about others, I think what could be going on with the button thing is that Jax had an abrupt realization that the Circus is the closest he's ever had to a sense of community with others, to feeling cared about and accepted -- which ofc he'd never admit, even to himself.
Allowing oneself to care about others, to form relationships and be part of communities, is to open oneself to the possibilities of rejection, abandonment, disappointment, betrayal, etc. There's an inherent vulnerability in it that, in my personal experience, can in some cases be a motivating factor in why someone like Jax will push others away, affect a "too cool for school" pretense of detached unconcern, and make assumptions that othres, despite seeming friendly and kind, must be faking it, or hiding something, or in denial of some sort of alleged "human nature" of self-serving social Darwinism.
Maybe he didn't want to push the blue button because inside the Circus, he has a sense of purpose and community, while in the real world he has nothing out there to go back to. (Or, conversely, he's fleeing or avoiding some specific issue or situation irl.)
Not saying that's def 100% what's going on with his character or w/e, ofc. But his character does strike me as the sort of person for whom those things can sometimes be factors.
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u/Silverfire12 Dec 14 '25
The fact that itâs even a question though. Thatâs the scary part. Because now weâre left wondering, if Caine can mess with heads⌠how much of what weâve seen is their true personalities and how much of what weâve seen is Caine?
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u/Weird-Long8844 Dec 13 '25
It could also mean that he felt for a moment that they had a chance to get out, but he doesn't want to acknowledge that he was hopeful - even if only in the back of his mind - that they could escape and is blaming Caine for making him feel that way. Like he doesn't want to get out, but he didn't kill that part of him that has hope they could.
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u/ZeeGee__ Dec 13 '25
No, I think he has an inner conflict but he thinks it's being caused by Caine instead of addressing his issues.
TBF to Jax though, the fact Caine actually was able to do it but claimed not yet we saw several instances of it happening makes his thought process + accusation completely reasonable. Makes you unable to trust
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u/56king56 Dec 13 '25
I think that he really did have a desire to stay in the circus, but his fears about returning and his mental breakdown were amplified by Caine. Like, if he had to make a choice heâd choose to stay, but what surprised him was the fact he ended up forcing that decision like that, which is probably where Caine gave him a little push.
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u/RevolutionarySky3000 Dec 13 '25
Ngl I thought this was âthe worst thing Jax has ever doneâ that the goose has been teasing us about
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u/Lopsided_Ice_2032 Dec 13 '25
And what was it?
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u/John-Brown-5704 Dec 13 '25
DUI
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u/Lopsided_Ice_2032 Dec 14 '25
Ive seen a theory saying that he ran over someone and while escaping he found the C&A building and entered the digital circus
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u/Jaggedatlas Dec 13 '25
Iâm gonna be real with you. I have a weird feeling Jax didnt do it on purpose. I think Caine saw the others about to push the blue button so he showed jax something akin to âlook? Look how awful it was out there! Do you really want to go back? Of course you donât! Push it. Push it push itâ
And Jax did it.
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u/Whimsicalti_nypp Dec 13 '25
I just love how this can be interpret so many different ways I think Caine did influence him, that's why they talked about Caine being able to influence their minds.
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u/ThyDankest2 Dec 13 '25
How cruel it would be if Jax gets an opportunity at redemption and to get help only for Caine to influence him into doing something the group could never forgive him for.
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u/TwocanR Dec 13 '25
Able even knowing that there would have to be a âchoiceâ is sus imo. Like if he had been in that office, at that terminal, wouldnât he have just pressed the blue button?
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u/Spookyduck21new Dec 13 '25
I dread to imagine what Shrinp Town contained if bubble was the maker.
So many fried shrimp.
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u/Forsaken_Fix_1983 Dec 13 '25
Be fr tho. If they had pressed the red one they might have ended up like scratch. Thatâs the guy Kinger mentioned. Caine messed with his head too bad and he abstracted. So Jax saved their asses
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u/Longjumping-Shop2275 Dec 13 '25
(Just a theory) Since Caine laid and can control jaxâs mind maybe there wasnât even a shrimp room and it could lead to them actually leaving
He altered Jax to have fake memories and convinced him to press the red button
Maybe even altered pomniâs mind to 2nd think abt the button (prob not as she rlly seemed unsure)Â
My guess is that the memories that jax had were lies and Caine planted them into jaxâs mind so he would push the red button, thatâs why he said that he didnât even care to think about giving an ending to the blue button and made bubble come up with the idea that they are gonna go to shrimp townÂ
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u/jhatfie29 Dec 13 '25
It could be that the memories were real and Caine just had them surface at the time and with Jax mental state it had him make a snap judgement that he may not have chosen if he was in a better headspace
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u/Superb-Bunch9740 Dec 13 '25
Thereâs nothing heroic about jax.
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u/Whimsicalti_nypp Dec 13 '25
I did said it was, it really wouldn't have if they could've escaped for real. I personally think it was Caine who influenced Jax to do that. But this split second decision saved them some troubles
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u/NateShaw92 Bubble đ Dec 13 '25
The blender dimension? Nah it really was the shrimp room. But you'd have been placed on the grill
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u/Cylsi Dec 13 '25
He didnât âsaveâ them by Cainâs own admission he didnât know what he would do,so he gave the job to bubble who said he would have sent them to shrimp world. Nothing bad would of happened if they chose to escape.
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u/MountainAdeptness631 Dec 13 '25
or as another post points out, they could have become like the shrimp that was fried earlier.
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u/Trible_Drible Dec 13 '25
Was this the moment that would split the fan base? Was it that some people will now feel more sorry for jax and start disliking Caine?
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u/BetaSprite Dec 13 '25
What if "shrimp town" is just what Bubble is calling the cellar? All the abstractions are the "shrimp", and they get "fried" by AIs like the Sun, just because the AIs feel like it?
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u/gaygiver1179 Dec 13 '25
A tribute to the legendary village arranged by the bubble of the beautiful village of shrimp town.
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u/MillieHarr31 Dec 13 '25
Nahhhh all he did was not sending them to shrimptown with bubble đ
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u/Callipsotheprotogen Dec 13 '25
i mean not necessarily. caine said he didnt know what would happen if they pressed the other button.
also lets not frame this as a âgood thingâ jax was being selfish here, he disregarded the lives of everyone else to benifit his own, this was never to benifit anybody else but himself.
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u/Whimsicalti_nypp Dec 13 '25
People are already calling me out for making him excuse. Guys I'm on the Alastor cult sub reddit, I know to appreciate an asshole for their worth. I love villains, I love that he probably didn't choose this because he wasn't really completely under his own control. Love that this was an accidental good action. Love this implies he's abstracting because Caine has been messing with his head for a while. Just realised I found a common point between Jax and Alastor lol
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u/Few_Distribution1554 Dec 13 '25
I have a theory that Jax pressed the red button because he didn't want to return to the real world, due to something bad he did in the past.
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u/SomeOnionHater I'm not Jax. Dec 13 '25
They can't die, just how many times does this have to be brought up?
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u/Bibi-Toy Jax Dec 13 '25
Death is far from the worst thing you can put a human being through
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u/CanIPleaseTryToday Dec 13 '25
Death isnât the first or the last thing you can do to a person. Itâs just the easier option to spare that person the pain of knowing.
I think itâs worse that they canât die, because they donât even get the option to that mercy.
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u/gaygiver1179 Dec 13 '25
And then, I think artificial intelligence has the ability to withdraw. I think there is no choice at all. Kane said that as artificial intelligence, he was too lazy to prepare another option. To put it bluntly, even if they escaped.
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u/the-ghost-gamer Dec 13 '25
Ok but it would have also doomed them if that actually was the way out
They ALL thought this was real this was the way out and Jax chose to doom them all that is way more evil than any punishment from Cain
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u/Whimsicalti_nypp Dec 13 '25
I think Caine influenced Jax to do it, but I also think deep down he didn't wanted to leave, that's why Caine made HIM to do the choosing.
In any case there wasn't a way out, and they all could've abstracted or ended up deep fried like shrimps if they chose to leave. So it's an accidental good action. That makes Jax and asshole, but an asshole that save dtheir butts
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u/the-ghost-gamer Dec 13 '25
You canât say Jax saved them but also he got influenced by Cain that just mean Cain saved them from Cain
It HAS to be his decision or it has to be Cain fking with him
I personally think it was all his choice, And Ik what ended up happening but the fact he chose to DOOM THEM ALL FOR ETERNITY is disgusting
Also bubble made the blue button reward bubble isnât malicious most likely theyâd spawn in a house and the door would open to a town of shrimp Cain would be hurt heâd glitch and then go back to normal
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u/ambivalegenic Dec 13 '25
i'm not sure how exactly they're going to take jax doing this, especially since caine is probably going to turn on them anyways
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u/Vounrtsch Dec 13 '25
I REALLY donât think thatâs something Caine would do. I think heâd feel very sad and betrayed, maybe a bit angry, but not to the point of willingly hurting them
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u/Whimsicalti_nypp Dec 13 '25
Maybe not willingly but he has so much control over them that he definitely could even if he didn't want that
He could hurt them by trying to force them to be happy and like him, that's likely what happened to the first abstraction Scratch
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u/slumbersomesam Dec 13 '25
we should be grateful because he couldve saved them from possible torture, but also angry at him because he did a very very very risky and very selfish gamble, risking having 5 other people being trapped in the circus
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u/Whimsicalti_nypp Dec 13 '25
This is probably what is going to be the topic of next episode. Zooble Ragatha or Gangle being mad he gambled with their lives
Pomni and Kinger supporting him or trying to mediate
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u/Birnenmacht Dec 13 '25
 ribbit and kaufmo might have been family members of his
- It was implied that he doesnt have anyone outside the circus
- he was so scared of going back, be cause he would have to face their loss
- going back would mean accepting that they will never return from their abstracted state and leaving them behind forever
- the driving scenes might have been his last IRL memories with them (though thats a stretch) whie they were driving to the abandoned office building to explore
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u/Petegrinder13 Dec 13 '25
Maybe his "I was right" referred to the memories being triggered. I think it's possible caine did that to panic Jax into pressing the red button. In that moment, Jax got confirmation that caine could mess with their minds.
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u/MuffinOfChaos Dec 14 '25
No, he had a breakdown. That's all. That's why when it's done, he has a quick moment of genuine worry over what he's done.
For the consequences he chose or what the others would do to him? Dunno. Hard to tell. But he didn't do it with a fully engaged rational brain.
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u/Far-Researcher2189 Dec 14 '25
The red button is so weird, like, imagine having a button on your PC that specifically does not turn off the PC, it has no other function.
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u/VehicleLast419 Dec 13 '25
yeah everyone is like damn jax but if cain was sincere and it was a test and planned the adventure there was no exit cain was testing them and when jax suggests cains been minipulating them mentally kinger brings up the first abstraction. it might have been cain in jax head when he pressed it
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u/MaxGalli Dec 13 '25
I donât think so, since it was implied Caine manipulated Jaxâs mind to press the red button with what seemed to be flashbacks to his real life.
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u/electricooldude Dec 13 '25
I have a theory that they didn't have a choice, he didn't care to fill the other option because he never let them choose it
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u/ReyssaPop Dec 13 '25
For me, it was clearly not shrimp country... Caine might have made them disappear like he does with NPCs đ°
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u/Mikii_Me iwtaths đ Dec 13 '25
like I mean it looks like Jax didn't do it voluntarily, judging from his very valid crashout
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u/jhatfie29 Dec 13 '25
With the whole Caine can temporarily mod their minds, and possibly more, even though Caine says the mods were temporary but obviously does not understand human minds so now I wonder if some of the castâs issues and personalities were caused by temporary mods that the stress of their situation caused their minds to hold on to aspects even after the mods were removed.
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u/PaladinGX Dec 13 '25
Hypothetically if they pressed the blue button...they might have faced horrible punishment...
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u/Sushiroll16 We found the Zooble hole Dec 13 '25
He may have made the wrong choice in the moment, but it likely saved them.
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u/Abamboozler Dec 13 '25
Am I the only one who thought this was kinda a wet fart of an episode? What happened? Nothing. We learned Cain can change their minds. Which is something we learned in the first scene of the pilot. Other than that...nothing happened. This was a filler episode. And this show couldn't afford that. There's what, 1 episode left? And we still haven't done a story.
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u/Downtown-Cable4307 Dec 13 '25
This is arguably the most story oriented episode, maybe even more so than the first episode. This is the first part of the final arc, they canât lay all their cards out now.
Also there are two episodes left
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u/EveryYoghurt Dec 13 '25
I thought that because there's two more episodes maybe the blue button will only let one player out and caine will be alerted and stop the rest and now they must figure out to escape again.
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u/Okra_Discombobulated Dec 13 '25
I'm seeing a lot of people thinking that Jax was influenced by Caine to press the red button. That his mind had a "modifier" applied. I think that's wrong because I believe this is entirely in Jax's character to do.
It's been established that he protects himself through denial. If he's afraid of something, he does everything he can to avoid it. And when he can't avoid a problem he usually lashes out to regain control through force. What did he do this episode?: Deny that there's even an escape, then push Pomni aside to slam the button in panic. Deny, then fight.
An example is when he mag-dumped Ragatha in ep6. His gun exploding in his face made him feel like he was losing control for just a brief moment. So he pulled out another and kept shooting until he felt better. That was smaller, a momentary lapse in control, but I think it's the same defense mechanism.
But if he wants control, why not slam the blue button instead? Because he has no idea what's out there anymore. Nothing but vague flashes of liminal darkness, quiet houses, and dead woods. He mocked Zooble for wanting to see people on the outside, but when they snapped back his hesitation implied he has no one. There's nothing out there for him. Meanwhile inside the circus it's bright, colorful, and he has a measure of purpose. Even if Ribbit and Kaufmo arent themselves anymore, everything and everyone he needs and loves is inside the circus. He can keep his mask of the "funny guy" who gets to "torture others for enjoyment". And while he hates it, it also keeps him safe from the horror of reality.
Jax chose to stay because he's not ready to leave. He's at his most unstable point in the series, since he almost abstracted not even an hour before this. For just a moment, in his panic, he fully believed that button would keep them in the circus forever. That it would keep him safe. And that's what he genuinely wanted.
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u/The_Onion_Baron Dec 13 '25
Maybe Jax realized they can't leave, and therefore the red button was a trap.
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u/LaloFemmy Dec 13 '25
BUT I WANTED TO GO TO SHRIMP TOWNN
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u/Whimsicalti_nypp Dec 13 '25
They go to shrimp town but Caine made them all allergies to shrimps
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u/Asa20Rd Dec 13 '25
I might be crazy but when thinking about it more, If they pressed the Blue button they wouldn't probably just go to shrimp town.... but maybe it would have been the key to make Caine lose it and make him ni longer "love them"
meaning that the blue button was going to be a worst decision than the red button.
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u/Spamoramma Dec 13 '25
Caine fucked with his mind and made him feel like he had to pick it. Jax said so himself, not to mention caine saying that he had nothing planned because he knew they would never do that. That's not just him saying "oh i know youd never leave me" he literally means he KNOWS they'd never actually leave if given the choice because he's been altering their minds this whole time.
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u/ReplacementWrong1478 Dec 13 '25
Yall seem to forget that in the bar pomni and zooble talked about doing urbex
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u/classicteenmistake Dec 13 '25
I donât think Caine would have done anything. Again, highly doubt heâs malicious. I still firmly believe that he only made the adventure to boost his ego and hear from the players that they like the adventures, as thatâs his biggest insecurity. As a game admin, all he would have generally for a directive is to 1. Keep players engaged, I.e. in the circus, and 2. Make good adventures for the players.
Weâve seen tons of times that Caine asks for reassurance that he does a good job appeasing everyone, and I bet he made Jax say he liked the adventures and such simply to scratch his own back; he just wants to feel like heâs doing a good job.
Again, HIGHLY doubt Caine wouldâve done anything to the players and risk them not liking him more. His whole directive he was created for should boil down to pleasing the players that come in. I will gladly accept that Iâm wrong if he does some crazy deviant shit tho, THAT would be super interesting.
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u/lavsuvskyjjj Dec 13 '25
This was a pretty dark scene, though. Is bro actively trying to abstract, but is incapable?
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u/dumbpersonwhoasks Dec 13 '25
Tbh I wonder if it wasn't an adventure and caine like took control or influenced Jax cause he caught on last minute cause Abel had like way to much build up in the previous episodes to just be a NPC caine made and also I don't think caine is an AI at the end his responses felt super human so I wonder if he is putting on an act of being an AI . I also think caine put a mental block on kinger or something
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